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battery_compatibility:pylontech_phantom [2020-06-19 16:01]
guy_stewart [1. Product & system compatibility]
battery_compatibility:pylontech_phantom [2021-04-24 16:06] (current)
guystewart [6. VE.Direct MPPT Settings]
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-====== Victron & Pylontech UP2500, US2000, US3000, Phantom-S Force-L1 =====+====== Victron & Pylontech UP2500, US2000, US3000, US2000C, US3000C, UP5000, Phantom-SForce-L1 & L2 =====
  
 The combination of Victron products with Pylontech lithium batteries has been tested and certified by the Victron and Pylontech R&D departments.  The combination of Victron products with Pylontech lithium batteries has been tested and certified by the Victron and Pylontech R&D departments. 
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 {{:battery_compatibility:pylontech_battery.png?direct&600|}} {{:battery_compatibility:pylontech_battery.png?direct&600|}}
  
-^  Battery ^ UP2500* ^ US2000 (Plus) ^ US3000 ^ Force-L1 ^ +^  Battery ^ UP2500* ^ US2000 (Plus/C) ^ US3000(C) ^ UP5000 ^ Force-L1 & L2 
-| Nominal voltage|  24V  |  48V  |  48V  |  48V  | +| Nominal voltage|  24V  |  48V  |  48V  |  48V  | 48V  | 
-|  Module capacity|  2.55 kWh  |  2.4 kWh  |  3.5 kWh| 3.55 kWh |+|  Module capacity|  2.55 kWh  |  2.4 kWh  |  3.5 kWh |  4.8 kwh  | 3.55 kWh |
  
 * Note that UP2500 came in two versions, UP2500N__A__01V00101 does not have a CANBUS port, and IS NOT supported by Victron. UP2500N__B__01V00101 released April 2020 has the CANBUS port and IS supported. * Note that UP2500 came in two versions, UP2500N__A__01V00101 does not have a CANBUS port, and IS NOT supported by Victron. UP2500N__B__01V00101 released April 2020 has the CANBUS port and IS supported.
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 === 1.2 A GX-device is required, eg Cerbo GX or Venus GX (VGX) ===  === 1.2 A GX-device is required, eg Cerbo GX or Venus GX (VGX) === 
  
-It is essential to use the CAN-bus connection of the [[venus-os:start|GX device]] (e.g. Cerbo GX or CCGXwith the batteries for the keep-alive signal, communication of charge and discharge limits, error codes and state of charge. +It is essential to use the CAN-bus connection of the [[venus-os:start|GX device]] (e.g. Cerbo GX) - this communicates the keep-alive signal, charge and discharge limits, error codes and state of charge (SOC %) between the batteries and the system
  
 For new systems, the minimum required firmware version for the [[https://www.victronenergy.com/live/venus-os:start|GX Device (e.g. Cerbo GX ]] is v2.42. It is highly recommended to use the latest firmware version on all connected devices, including the GX device Inverter/Charger and MPPTs. There are regular updates to improve performance and reliability.  For new systems, the minimum required firmware version for the [[https://www.victronenergy.com/live/venus-os:start|GX Device (e.g. Cerbo GX ]] is v2.42. It is highly recommended to use the latest firmware version on all connected devices, including the GX device Inverter/Charger and MPPTs. There are regular updates to improve performance and reliability. 
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 ===== 2. Minimum Battery Sizing Recommendations  ===== ===== 2. Minimum Battery Sizing Recommendations  =====
-The charge and discharge rates are managed automatically by the Pylontech battery and [[venus-os:start|GX device]]+Once DVCC is enabled on the GX device, the charge and discharge rates are managed by the Pylontech battery.
  
 Using very large solar arrays with battery banks that are too small can exceed the limits of the batteries ability to charge and possibly lead to the BMS triggering over-current alarms. Using very large solar arrays with battery banks that are too small can exceed the limits of the batteries ability to charge and possibly lead to the BMS triggering over-current alarms.
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 Some suggested battery sizings for common Victron inverter/chargers are listed below. These are suggestions for reliable operation for single phase off grid and are not specified by Pylontech.  Some suggested battery sizings for common Victron inverter/chargers are listed below. These are suggestions for reliable operation for single phase off grid and are not specified by Pylontech. 
  
-Using the above formula, an example of minimum system sizing based on the US2000B Plus battery module is below. Each battery module is approximately 50Ah at 48V, can provide 25A continuous charge and discharge and 100A peak for 1 minute.+Using the above formula, an example of minimum system sizing based on the US2000 battery module is below. Each battery module is approximately 50Ah at 48V, can provide 25A continuous charge and discharge and 100A peak for 1 minute.
  
 ^ Inverter / Charger Model ^ Inv continuous watts @ 25 degrees ^ Inverter peak watts surge rating ^ Number of Pylontech modules ^ Battery continuous discharge watt rating ^ Battery peak discharge watt rating ^  ^ Inverter / Charger Model ^ Inv continuous watts @ 25 degrees ^ Inverter peak watts surge rating ^ Number of Pylontech modules ^ Battery continuous discharge watt rating ^ Battery peak discharge watt rating ^ 
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 The battery with the empty link port 0 is the master battery.  The battery with the empty link port 0 is the master battery. 
-You must use the //VE.Can to CAN-bus BMS type B Cable//, part number ASS030720018, you cannot use the cable supplied by Pylontech. +You must use the //VE.Can to CAN-bus BMS type B Cable//, part number ASS030720018 for connection with US2000/US3000/UP2500; and //VE.Can to CAN-bus BMS type A Cable//, part number ASS030710018 for connection with US2000C/US3000C/UP5000/Force-L, you cannot use the cable supplied by Pylontech.  
 + 
 +Plug the communication cable with the side which is labeled Battery BMS into the Pylontech CAN port of the master battery.  
 + 
 +Some GX devices (such as the Cerbo GX), have multiple CAN ports. If your GX device has a BMS-Can port, this should be used. If your GX device ONLY has VE.Can ports, you will need to this for the battery (and then it cannot be used for other VE.Can devices). 
 + 
 +Plug the side labeled Victron VE.Can into the [[venus-os:start|GX device]]. 
  
-Plug the type B cable with the side which is labeled Battery BMS into the Pylontech CAN port of the master battery. Plug the side labeled Victron VE.Can into the [[venus-os:start|GX device]]. 
  
 Then, plug a [[https://www.victronenergy.com/accessories/ve-can-rj45-terminator|VE.Can terminator]] in the other VE.Can socket on the [[venus-os:start|GX device]]. Two VE.Can terminators are included with the package of the [[venus-os:start|GX device]] as an accessory, only one is used. Keep the other one as a spare. Then, plug a [[https://www.victronenergy.com/accessories/ve-can-rj45-terminator|VE.Can terminator]] in the other VE.Can socket on the [[venus-os:start|GX device]]. Two VE.Can terminators are included with the package of the [[venus-os:start|GX device]] as an accessory, only one is used. Keep the other one as a spare.
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 On the [[venus-os:start|GX device]],  On the [[venus-os:start|GX device]], 
  
-  * Select the //CAN-bus BMS (500 kbit/s)// CAN-profile in the CCGX. Menu path: //Settings -> Services -> CAN-profile//. +  * If your GX device has a BMS-Can port, the battery should be connected to this.  
 +  * If you connect the BMS to the VE.Can port you will need to adjust the port speed. Select the //CAN-bus BMS (500 kbit/s)// CAN-profile in the GX device. Menu path: //Settings -> Services -> VE.CAN port//. 
  
 After properly wiring and setting the correct CAN-bus speed, the Pylontech will be visible as a battery in the device list. If you have multiple batteries a single entry will show up, which represents all batteries: After properly wiring and setting the correct CAN-bus speed, the Pylontech will be visible as a battery in the device list. If you have multiple batteries a single entry will show up, which represents all batteries:
 {{ :battery_compatibility:pylon-menu.png?nolink&400 |}} {{ :battery_compatibility:pylon-menu.png?nolink&400 |}}
  
-When the battery is correctly connected this will also set the following values automatically:+Next, go to Settings, DVCC, and configure as follows:
  
 ^Venus Settings -> System Setup Parameter ^ Value ^  ^Venus Settings -> System Setup Parameter ^ Value ^ 
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 |Shared Temperature Sense |OFF|  |Shared Temperature Sense |OFF| 
  
 +For more information about the behaviour of DVCC, please see the [[https://www.victronenergy.com/media/pg/Cerbo_GX/en/dvcc---distributed-voltage-and-current-control.html|GX device manual]]. 
  
-  * The parameters option within the battery page shows the actual battery charge and discharge limits+Note: The "Limit managed battery charge voltage" feature should be left OFF, unless you are experiencing "High Voltage" or "Internal Error" alarms. These alarms can indicate that there is an internal cell imbalance in the battery. It may be useful in this situation to enable this feature, and then adjust the voltage limit down so that the batteries are able to balance charge without reaching over voltage internally. This imbalance is at a cell level, so might not be reflected as a high overall battery voltage if measured with a Multimeter. This can then be turned off once the battery has balanced itself properly.  
 + 
 +The 'limit charge current' value that you set manually in the DVCC menu of the GX device will allow you to set a value less than the ceiling Charge Current Limit (CCL) set by the BMS, if you want to further restrict system wide charge current for some reason. You can enter a larger number than the CCL, but the system will then stop at the CCL number (and not your manually entered figure). 
 + 
 +For example if you only wired in 80A capacity wire / fuses through the system, and didn't want the potential combined power delivery of a generator charging as well as a solar charge, you could limit the total system charging (MPPT + MultiPlus) to that lower level, even though the batteries could potentially absorb more. 
 + 
 +  * The parameters option within the battery page shows the battery charge and discharge limits as communicated to the DVCC system by the BMS.
 {{ :battery_compatibility:pylon-params.png?nolink&400 |}} {{ :battery_compatibility:pylon-params.png?nolink&400 |}}
 +
 +The 'charge current limit' (CCL) as shown in the parameters screen (and received from the BMS, by the GX device, via DVCC) will be the ceiling, and the system will try its best not to exceed that (as much as it can - it may spike under momentary peaking conditions).
  
 This parameters page is also a good place to check that all batteries are connected and working properly. In see the individual battery data sheet for the normal working conditions, e.g. the current limit per cell. For example, If each battery is rated to 25A charge current, and the menu shows a 75A charge current limit ( 75 / 25 = 3 ) means there are 3 Pylontech battery modules connected.  This parameters page is also a good place to check that all batteries are connected and working properly. In see the individual battery data sheet for the normal working conditions, e.g. the current limit per cell. For example, If each battery is rated to 25A charge current, and the menu shows a 75A charge current limit ( 75 / 25 = 3 ) means there are 3 Pylontech battery modules connected. 
  
 Note that 'details' menu of the battery (e.g. Lowest and Highest cell voltages etc) is not currently supported by Pylontech.  Note that 'details' menu of the battery (e.g. Lowest and Highest cell voltages etc) is not currently supported by Pylontech. 
 +
 +In off-grid systems, the inverter will prioritise running the load, and potentially exceed this Discharge Current Limit. This could lead to the battery shutting down, and why it is important to follow the minimum battery sizing guide.
 +
 +In grid connected ESS systems, the inverter will do its best to respect the Discharge Current Limit and use the grid to supplement the load if required.
  
 ===== 5. VEConfigure Settings ===== ===== 5. VEConfigure Settings =====
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 This section presumes familiarity with [[https://www.victronenergy.com/upload/documents/Manual-A-Guide-to-VEConfigure-EN.pdf|VEConfigure software.]]  This section presumes familiarity with [[https://www.victronenergy.com/upload/documents/Manual-A-Guide-to-VEConfigure-EN.pdf|VEConfigure software.]] 
  
-Voltages shown are for the 48V model, and should be divided for the 24V model.+Voltages shown are for the 48V model, and should be scaled for the 24V model. The 24V model is an 8-series configuration while the 48V model is a 15-series configuration. Voltages should therefore be scaled by 8/15.
  
 === 5.1 General tab === === 5.1 General tab ===
  
   * Check the "Enable battery monitor" function   * Check the "Enable battery monitor" function
-  * Set the battery capacity to the total capacity of the battery: eg 50Ah times the number of battery modules for the 2000B Plus model.+  * Set the battery capacity to the total capacity of the battery: eg 50Ah times the number of battery modules for the US2000 model.
   * The other parameters ("State of charge when bulk finished" and "Charge efficiency") can be left to their default setting: They are ignored for a Pylontech installation.   * The other parameters ("State of charge when bulk finished" and "Charge efficiency") can be left to their default setting: They are ignored for a Pylontech installation.
  
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 ^MPPT Parameter ^ Setting ^ ^MPPT Parameter ^ Setting ^
 |Battery voltage.     |48V| |Battery voltage.     |48V|
-|Absorption voltage   |53V|+|Absorption voltage   |52V|
  
 +Note for MPPT RS - the Remote Mode in VictronConnect must be set to Remote on/off, not BMS.
 ===== 7. Example Wiring Diagram ===== ===== 7. Example Wiring Diagram =====
  
-{{ :battery_compatibility:pylon-diagram-2018-12-28.jpg?direct&800 |}} +{{:battery_compatibility:ds_-_pylontech_-_managed_lithium_battery_-_2021-3-11.jpg?direct&800|}}
 ===== 8. Troubleshooting ===== ===== 8. Troubleshooting =====
  
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 You can confirm if this is affecting your installation be entering the Pylontech Battery menu on your GX device, and then the Parameters Menu. This will report the Charge Current Limit (CCL) and Discharge Current Limit (DCL). This information is also logged in the advanced section of the VRM monitoring portal.  You can confirm if this is affecting your installation be entering the Pylontech Battery menu on your GX device, and then the Parameters Menu. This will report the Charge Current Limit (CCL) and Discharge Current Limit (DCL). This information is also logged in the advanced section of the VRM monitoring portal. 
  
-==== My system only charges the battery to 52V ====+==== My system only charges the battery to 52.4V ====
 When DVCC is enabled, the battery (via the CAN-bms) is responsible for the charge voltage. The Pylontech battery requests a charge voltage of 53.2V. We have however found that in practice this is too high. When DVCC is enabled, the battery (via the CAN-bms) is responsible for the charge voltage. The Pylontech battery requests a charge voltage of 53.2V. We have however found that in practice this is too high.
  
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 It should also be noted that a LiFePO4 cell stores very little additional energy above 3.45V. It should also be noted that a LiFePO4 cell stores very little additional energy above 3.45V.
  
-For this reason we opted to override the BMS and cap the voltage at 52V. This sacrifices almost none of the capacity and greatly improves the stability of the system.+For this reason we opted to override the BMS and cap the voltage at 52.4V. This sacrifices almost none of the capacity and greatly improves the stability of the system.
  
 ==== The battery won't charge to 100% ==== ==== The battery won't charge to 100% ====
-Also see the question above. The state of charge of the battery is estimated based on the overall voltage and on how well balanced the internal cells are. Because we cap the battery voltage at 52V, the state of charge will sometimes rise very slowly once it reaches the mid-90s. This is normal and usually resolves over time.+Also see the question above. The state of charge of the battery is estimated based on the overall voltage and on how well balanced the internal cells are. Because we cap the battery voltage at 52.4V, the state of charge will sometimes rise very slowly once it reaches the mid-90s. This is normal and usually resolves over time
 + 
 +==== 'Internal Error' shown on battery status ==== 
 +The 'Internal Error' shown in battery status is not a critical error. This only defines that within a battery system, some of the slave batteries are offline(which is due to these modules have been discharged to an extremely low SOC or being in idle mode for more than 72hrs), once the system is available for a charging activity such an error will be automatically eliminated.  
 + 
 +==== 'High voltage' warning or alarm shown on battery status ==== 
 +The 'high voltage' warning or alarm is not unusual on new batteries that are not yet balanced. To help the batteries balance quickly, keep the batteries fully charged until the errors go away. 
 +In an ESS system, set it to 'keep batteries charged', in an off-grid system the fastest way is to either charge / balance the battery before installation, or to fully charge with a generator if not enough solar is available to keep the batteries fully charged. 
 + 
 +If you are unable to maintain the target voltage to balance the batteries without the 'high voltage' alarm occurring, you may need to enable and set the "Limit managed battery charge voltage" setting in the DVCC menu of the GX device. Reduce this voltage as necessary until the alarm stops.  
 +After sufficient time to balance the batteries, try increasing this value until it can be disabled again for normal operation.  
 + 
 +{{:battery_compatibility:maximum_charge_voltage.jpg?400|}} 
 + 
 +If it is not possible to raise the voltage over time, and eventually disable this manual override: 
 + 
 +1: If you have 2 or more batteries in your system, you can try shutting down the system once it is as close to fully charged as possible, and then physically connecting the batteries in smaller groups (or even individually) so that balancing can occur on each individual battery without it being masked by the others connected in parallel. It may help you to see the indicator lights on the battery (if available on that model) to find which battery might be out of balance with the others.
  
 +2: Contact your Pylontech dealer for further assistance (they can provide additional software to see individual cell level data), or assist with other potential solutions. 
 ===== 10. Further Information ===== ===== 10. Further Information =====
  
battery_compatibility/pylontech_phantom.1592575297.txt.gz · Last modified: 2020-06-19 16:01 by guy_stewart