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ve.bus:manual_parallel_and_three_phase_systems [2019-12-13 03:32]
simonhackett Add reminder that DVCC overrides the charger settings (just as it does in single unit systems)
ve.bus:manual_parallel_and_three_phase_systems [2020-11-23 23:46] (current)
guy_stewart
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 Parallel and Multiphase systems are complex.  We do not support or recommend that untrained and/or inexperienced installers work on these size systems. Parallel and Multiphase systems are complex.  We do not support or recommend that untrained and/or inexperienced installers work on these size systems.
  
-Victron is able to provide specific training for these systems to [[https://www.victronenergy.com/where-to-buy|distributors]] via their [[https://www.victronenergy.com/contact|regional sales manager]].  +Victron is able to provide specific training for these systems to [[https://www.victronenergy.com/where-to-buy|distributors]] via their [[https://www.victronenergy.com/contact|regional sales manager]]. There is advanced training theory and practical videos and competency exams for 3 phase and parallel installation and commissioning available on [[http://professional.victronenergy.com/online-training/|Victron Professional -> Online Training]]. You will require an installer account on Victron Professional to access it
-This should be considered essential before attempting design or installation.  + 
 +These should all be considered essential before attempting design or installation.  
  
 First get experience with smaller systems. If you are new to Victron, please start with simpler designs, so that you become familiar with the necessary training, equipment and software required. First get experience with smaller systems. If you are new to Victron, please start with simpler designs, so that you become familiar with the necessary training, equipment and software required.
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 Using our 15kVA Quattros, the maximum system size is a 180kVA three phase system. Which then consists of four units on each of the three phases: 12 units in total. Using our 15kVA Quattros, the maximum system size is a 180kVA three phase system. Which then consists of four units on each of the three phases: 12 units in total.
  
-Using our 10kVA Quattrosthe maximum system size is a 150kVA three phase system. Which then consists of five units on each of the three phases: 15 units in total.+When using smaller modelsthere is a maximum of five units in parallel, on each of the three phases: 15 units in total. For example, using 10kVA Quattros, the maximum system size is a 150kVA three phase system.
  
 __Single phase systems__ __Single phase systems__
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 Also beware of sizing the battery cable and jumpers between cells/batteries. Also beware of sizing the battery cable and jumpers between cells/batteries.
  
-For units in parallel: Both the DC and AC wiring needs to be symmetrical per phase: use the same length, type and cross-section to every unit in the phase. To make this easy, use a bus-bar or power-post before and after the inverter/chargers.+For units in parallel: Both the DC and AC wiring needs to be symmetrical per phase: use the same length, type and cross-section to every unit in the phase. To make this easy, use a bus-bar or power-post before and after the inverter/chargers. Also, apply the same torque on all connections.
  
-For units in parallel: use one AC fuse for all units on that phaseBoth on the input, and on the outputMultiple fuses which are mechanically connected together is ok: that is also one fuse.+With regards to AC fusing, each unit needs to be fused individuallyMake sure to use the same type of fuse on each unit due to same resistanceConsider using mechanically connected fuses.
  
-For DC, one fuse per phase is best. If a big single fuse is not available, use one fuse per unit. Same type of fuse due to same resistance.+With regards to DC fusingeach unit needs to be fused individuallyMake sure to use the same type of fuse on each unit due to same resistance
 + 
 +For both AC and DC fusing and protection, consult the product manual for details and recommended ratings.
  
 Beware of phase rotation between the inverter and AC in. When wired in a rotation that is different to the programming of the Multis, the system will not accept the mains input and only operates in inverter mode. [[https://www.victronenergy.com/live/ccgx:start#phase_rotation_warning|If a GX device is connected, it will signal a phase rotation alarm]]. In that case swap two phases to correct it, or re-program the units to match the wiring rotation.  Beware of phase rotation between the inverter and AC in. When wired in a rotation that is different to the programming of the Multis, the system will not accept the mains input and only operates in inverter mode. [[https://www.victronenergy.com/live/ccgx:start#phase_rotation_warning|If a GX device is connected, it will signal a phase rotation alarm]]. In that case swap two phases to correct it, or re-program the units to match the wiring rotation. 
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       * Using 2 units (A and B) parallel and using extremely good cabling one might achieve a total resistance for Unit_A of 0.0001Ω and a total resistance for Unit_B of 0.0002Ω. This results in Unit_A carrying twice as much current as Unit_B although the resistance difference is very small.       * Using 2 units (A and B) parallel and using extremely good cabling one might achieve a total resistance for Unit_A of 0.0001Ω and a total resistance for Unit_B of 0.0002Ω. This results in Unit_A carrying twice as much current as Unit_B although the resistance difference is very small.
       * Using the same 2 units in parallel with bad AC cabling one might end up with a total resistance for Unit_A of 15Ω and a total resistance for Unit_B of 16Ω. This results in a much better current distribution (Unit_A will carry 1.066 times more current than Unit_A) even if the absolute difference in resistance is much bigger than in the previous example (1Ω vs 0.0001Ω).       * Using the same 2 units in parallel with bad AC cabling one might end up with a total resistance for Unit_A of 15Ω and a total resistance for Unit_B of 16Ω. This results in a much better current distribution (Unit_A will carry 1.066 times more current than Unit_A) even if the absolute difference in resistance is much bigger than in the previous example (1Ω vs 0.0001Ω).
 +
 +For units in 3 phase configuration: Our products have been designed for a star (Y) type three phase configuration. In a star configuration all neutrals are connected, a so called: "distributed neutral"
 +We do not support a delta (Δ) configuration. A delta configuration does not have a distributed neutral and will lead to certain inverter features not operating as expected. 
 ==== A continuous, unbroken negative link must be maintained between all units ==== ==== A continuous, unbroken negative link must be maintained between all units ====
  
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 ==== Theory and background information ====  ==== Theory and background information ==== 
  
-wiring is further explained in these presentations:+Wiring is further explained here:
   * {{:ve.bus:4._ripple_in_a_ac_battery_system.pdf|presentation - DC Ripple}}   * {{:ve.bus:4._ripple_in_a_ac_battery_system.pdf|presentation - DC Ripple}}
   * {{:ve.bus:rva_-_theory_on_wiring_large_systems.pdf|presentation - Theory on wiring large systems}}'   * {{:ve.bus:rva_-_theory_on_wiring_large_systems.pdf|presentation - Theory on wiring large systems}}'
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 The following settings need to be made in the master of each phase: The following settings need to be made in the master of each phase:
   * Inverter output voltage   * Inverter output voltage
-  * Input current limits\\ (the effective input current limit is the setted limit multiplied by the number of units per phase. For example, setting a 10A limit with VEConfigure in a system with two units per phase results on a 20A limit for that phase. Being able to set a different limit per phase allows for maximum configurability.\\ \\ Setting an input current limit works differently when setting the AC input current limit on a remote control panel, for example a DMC or GX device. Then (a) only one value can be set by the user, not one per phase, and (b) the configured limit will be used as the limit per phase. The difference is due to the different use case of both ways of setting it: settings in VEConfigure are supposed to be fixed in the install and done be the installer, for example matching an installed generator. And the input current limit as set on the GX device is intended to be set by the end-user, for example on a yacht or in a motor home, and being able to set it depending on the actual shore connection - and ofcourse without having to do the maths of multiplying with the number of installed units on a phase.)+  * Input current limits\\ (the effective input current limit is the setted limit multiplied by the number of units per phase. For example, setting a 10A limit with VEConfigure in a system with two units per phase results on a 20A limit for that phase. Being able to set a different limit per phase allows for maximum configurability.\\ \\ Setting an input current limit works differently when setting it on a remote control panel, for example a DMC or GX device. Then (a) only one value can be set by the user, not a different for each phase, and (b) the configured limit will be used as the total limit for each phase. Example, setting 30A in a three phase system of six units (two per phase), on a DMC or GX Device, results in a max input current limit of 30A per phase. The difference of both methods is due to the different use case of both ways of setting it: settings in VEConfigure are supposed to be fixed in the install and done be the installer, for example matching an installed generator. And the input current limit as set on the GX device is intended to be set by the end-user, for example on a yacht or in a motor home, and being able to set it depending on the actual shore connection - and ofcourse without having to do the maths of multiplying with the number of installed units on a phase.)
   * UPS function on/off   * UPS function on/off
   * PowerAssist settings   * PowerAssist settings
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   * If you are using a self-consumption assistant, such as ESS, Hub-1 to Hub-4, the assistant will need to be loaded into each unit in the system individually.\\    * If you are using a self-consumption assistant, such as ESS, Hub-1 to Hub-4, the assistant will need to be loaded into each unit in the system individually.\\ 
   * PV Inverter Assistant needs to be loaded into each unit in the system.   * PV Inverter Assistant needs to be loaded into each unit in the system.
-  * The VE.Bus BMS and the Two-Signal BMS support Assistant also need to be loaded in each unit in the system. +  * The VE.Bus BMS and the Two-Signal BMS support Assistant also need to be loaded in each unit in the system individually. Program each Multi separately.  
-(nb: In some cases (depending on the choices made) slaves can be left out, the assistant will notify you about this.)+  * For the [[https://www.victronenergy.com/upload/documents/Manual-Connecting-other-lithium-battery-systems-to-Multis-and-Quattros-EN.pdf|Two-Signal BMS assistant]]during the first Multi setup there are questions about which Aux connection ports the BMS is connected. When setting up the second and third Multi assistant setup, you choose that BMS is connected to "other" Multi, and the setup will end. Only the unit that is physically wired to the BMS will be set up fully with the options selected matching the physical hardware interface connections.
  
 With all the other Assistants: genset start/stop, relay locker etcetera, a unique configuration can be made in each unit. With all the other Assistants: genset start/stop, relay locker etcetera, a unique configuration can be made in each unit.
  
-Tip: a quick way to load Assistants into each unit in the system is to save the settings after configuring the master in L1. Then open VEConfigure for another unit and load that file. VEConfigure will automatically adapt the Assistants for the slaves. (note: In some cases you might get some warnings. Please step through the assistant in that case.) 
 ===== Tips and hints ===== ===== Tips and hints =====
   * {{:ve.bus:4._ripple_in_a_ac_battery_system.pdf|presentation - DC Ripple}}   * {{:ve.bus:4._ripple_in_a_ac_battery_system.pdf|presentation - DC Ripple}}
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 ===== Training Video ===== ===== Training Video =====
  
-There is an advanced training video and competency exam for 3 phase and parallel installation and commissioning available on [[https://professional.victronenergy.com|Victron Professional -> E-Learning.]] You will require an installer account on Victron Professional to access it.+There is an advanced training video and competency exam for 3 phase and parallel installation and commissioning available on [[https://professional.victronenergy.com/online-training|Victron Professional -> Online Training.]] You will require an installer account on Victron Professional to access it.
  
  
ve.bus/manual_parallel_and_three_phase_systems.1576204365.txt.gz · Last modified: 2019-12-13 03:32 by simonhackett