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battery_compatibility:pylontech_phantom [2019-10-30 12:11]
guy_stewart [2. Minimum Battery Sizing Recommendations]
battery_compatibility:pylontech_phantom [2020-09-19 11:53]
boekel [The battery won't charge to 100%]
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-====== Victron & Pylontech US2000, US3000 and Phantom-S =====+====== Victron & Pylontech UP2500, US2000, US3000Phantom-S & Force-L1 =====
  
 The combination of Victron products with Pylontech lithium batteries has been tested and certified by the Victron and Pylontech R&D departments.  The combination of Victron products with Pylontech lithium batteries has been tested and certified by the Victron and Pylontech R&D departments. 
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 {{:battery_compatibility:pylontech_battery.png?direct&600|}} {{:battery_compatibility:pylontech_battery.png?direct&600|}}
  
-^  Battery ^  US2000 (Plus) ^ US3000 ^ Force-L1 ^ +^  Battery ^ UP2500* ^ US2000 (Plus) ^ US3000 ^ Force-L1 ^ 
-|  Module capacity|  2.4 kWh |  3.5 kWh| 3.55 kWh |+| Nominal voltage|  24V  |  48V  |  48V  |  48V  | 
 +|  Module capacity|  2.55 kWh  |  2.4 kWh  |  3.5 kWh| 3.55 kWh | 
 + 
 +* Note that UP2500 came in two versions, UP2500N__A__01V00101 does not have a CANBUS port, and IS NOT supported by Victron. UP2500N__B__01V00101 released April 2020 has the CANBUS port and IS supported.
  
 === 1.1 Offgrid, Backup and Energy Storage Systems are possible === === 1.1 Offgrid, Backup and Energy Storage Systems are possible ===
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-=== 1.2 A GX-device is required, eg Color Control GX (CCGX) or Venus GX (VGX) === +=== 1.2 A GX-device is required, eg Cerbo GX or Venus GX (VGX) ===  
 + 
 +It is essential to use the CAN-bus connection of the [[venus-os:start|GX device]] (e.g. Cerbo GX or CCGX) with the batteries for the keep-alive signal, communication of charge and discharge limits, error codes and state of charge.  
 + 
 +For new systems, the minimum required firmware version for the [[https://www.victronenergy.com/live/venus-os:start|GX Device (e.g. Cerbo GX ]] is v2.42. It is highly recommended to use the latest firmware version on all connected devices, including the GX device Inverter/Charger and MPPTs. There are regular updates to improve performance and reliability. 
  
-It is essential to use the CAN-bus connection of the [[venus-os:start|GX device]] (eg CCGX or VGX) with the batteries for the keep-alive signal, communication of charge and discharge limits, error codes and state of charge+Legacy systems installed with v2.15 can continue to be used without upgrade as long as they do not present any issues
  
-The minimum required firmware version for the [[https://www.victronenergy.com/panel-systems-remote-monitoring/color-control|Color Control GX]] is v2.15. It is highly recommended to use the latest firmware version on all connected devices, including CCGX/VGX, Inverter/Charger and MPPTs. There are regular updates to improve performance and reliability.  
  
 +=== 1.3 All Multi, MultiPlus, MultiGrid and Quattro are compatible ===
  
-=== 1.3 All 48V MultiMultiPlus, MultiGrid and Quattro are compatible ===+As long as you are using the appropriate model for the nominal battery voltageall VE.Bus inverters and inverter/chargers are compatible
  
-The minimum firmware version is 422. Though updating to the latest firmware is recommended where possible.+The minimum firmware version for new installations is 469. Though [[https://docs.victronenergy.com/victronconnect-vebus.html#firmware-updates|updating to the latest firmware]] is recommended where possible, and a necessary first step when troubleshooting issues.
  
 These inverter/charger units must be connected to the [[venus-os:start|GX device]] via the VE.Bus connection port.  These inverter/charger units must be connected to the [[venus-os:start|GX device]] via the VE.Bus connection port. 
  
 +Legacy systems installed with VE.Bus firmware 422 can continue to be used without upgrade as long as they do not present any issues. 
  
-=== 1.4 All 48V VE.direct BlueSolar and SmartSolar MPPT Chargers are compatible ===+=== 1.4 All VE.Direct BlueSolar and SmartSolar MPPT Chargers are compatible ===
  
 For proper operation, the Pylontech battery needs to be able to control the charge current. Therefor it is recommended to use Victron 48V compatible MPPTs models with VE.Direct port for charging. For proper operation, the Pylontech battery needs to be able to control the charge current. Therefor it is recommended to use Victron 48V compatible MPPTs models with VE.Direct port for charging.
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 __MPPTs with a VE.Can port__ __MPPTs with a VE.Can port__
  
-Use of VE.Can MPPT'with Pylontech batteries is not supported or documented.+New Model (2019 and later) VE.Can MPPTs are also supported from firmware version 1.06 and above. Be aware that some GX devices (e.g. CCGX) only have a single CANBus interface, and that is required for the battery communications. So if you use a new VE.Can MPPT, it must also be with a GX device that has more than one CANbus interface, e.g. the Cerbo GX. 
 +  
 +Old model VE.Can MPPTs (pre 2019) are not supported. 
  
  
 ===== 2. Minimum Battery Sizing Recommendations  ===== ===== 2. Minimum Battery Sizing Recommendations  =====
- 
-Each US2000B Plus battery module is approximately 50Ah at 48V, can provide 25A continuous charge and discharge and 100A peak for 1 minute. 
- 
 The charge and discharge rates are managed automatically by the Pylontech battery and [[venus-os:start|GX device]].  The charge and discharge rates are managed automatically by the Pylontech battery and [[venus-os:start|GX device]]. 
  
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 Some suggested battery sizings for common Victron inverter/chargers are listed below. These are suggestions for reliable operation for single phase off grid and are not specified by Pylontech.  Some suggested battery sizings for common Victron inverter/chargers are listed below. These are suggestions for reliable operation for single phase off grid and are not specified by Pylontech. 
 +
 +Using the above formula, an example of minimum system sizing based on the US2000B Plus battery module is below. Each battery module is approximately 50Ah at 48V, can provide 25A continuous charge and discharge and 100A peak for 1 minute.
  
 ^ Inverter / Charger Model ^ Inv continuous watts @ 25 degrees ^ Inverter peak watts surge rating ^ Number of Pylontech modules ^ Battery continuous discharge watt rating ^ Battery peak discharge watt rating ^  ^ Inverter / Charger Model ^ Inv continuous watts @ 25 degrees ^ Inverter peak watts surge rating ^ Number of Pylontech modules ^ Battery continuous discharge watt rating ^ Battery peak discharge watt rating ^ 
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 You can connect multiple battery modules together to form a single large battery by connecting the RJ-45 cable supplied by Pylontech using the link ports on the battery. This is shown in more detail in the  [[https://www.victronenergy.com/live/_media/battery_compatibility:pylon-diagram-2018-12-28.jpg|example wiring diagram]] and Pylontech manual. You can connect multiple battery modules together to form a single large battery by connecting the RJ-45 cable supplied by Pylontech using the link ports on the battery. This is shown in more detail in the  [[https://www.victronenergy.com/live/_media/battery_compatibility:pylon-diagram-2018-12-28.jpg|example wiring diagram]] and Pylontech manual.
  
-The batteries will automatically detect and link to each other, no adjustment of dip switches or software changes are necessary on the batteries+The communications for UP2500 can be paralleled up to 20 modules per string (and cannot use the LV-HUB). Other models can connect up to 8 battery modules (see Pylontech data sheets), in those models when using more than 8 parallel units, some limitations, additional configuration or equipment (e.g. Pylontech LV-Hub) may apply. See your Pylontech dealer, and Pylontech documentation for more details.  
 + 
 +The batteries will automatically detect and link to each other, no adjustment of dip switches on the battery module are necessary
  
 The battery with the empty link port 0 is the master battery.  The battery with the empty link port 0 is the master battery. 
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 It is important to ensure this connection and display of the battery on the [[venus-os:start|GX device]] display before attempting firmware updates or settings changes on other devices if they depend on the power supply from the battery. Without this connection, the battery may turn off unexpectedly.  It is important to ensure this connection and display of the battery on the [[venus-os:start|GX device]] display before attempting firmware updates or settings changes on other devices if they depend on the power supply from the battery. Without this connection, the battery may turn off unexpectedly. 
  
 +===== 4. GX Device Settings =====
  
-===== 4. VEConfigure Settings =====+On the [[venus-os:start|GX device]], 
  
-You will need the latest firmware on all connected devices. +  * Select the //CAN-bus BMS (500 kbit/s)// CAN-profile in the CCGX. Menu path: //Settings -> Services -> CAN-profile//.  
 + 
 +After properly wiring and setting the correct CAN-bus speed, the Pylontech will be visible as a battery in the device list. If you have multiple batteries a single entry will show up, which represents all batteries: 
 +{{ :battery_compatibility:pylon-menu.png?nolink&400 |}} 
 + 
 +When the battery is correctly connected this will also set the following values automatically: 
 + 
 +^Venus Settings -> System Setup Parameter ^ Value ^  
 +|DVCC|ON| 
 +|Shared Voltage Sense |OFF|  
 +|Shared Temperature Sense |OFF|  
 + 
 + 
 +  * The parameters option within the battery page shows the actual battery charge and discharge limits 
 +{{ :battery_compatibility:pylon-params.png?nolink&400 |}} 
 + 
 +This parameters page is also a good place to check that all batteries are connected and working properly. In see the individual battery data sheet for the normal working conditions, e.g. the current limit per cell. For example, If each battery is rated to 25A charge current, and the menu shows a 75A charge current limit ( 75 / 25 = 3 ) means there are 3 Pylontech battery modules connected.  
 + 
 +Note that 'details' menu of the battery (e.g. Lowest and Highest cell voltages etc) is not currently supported by Pylontech.  
 + 
 +===== 5. VEConfigure Settings ===== 
 + 
 +When using the latest firmware on all compatible connected devices, and once the battery module has been detected by the GX device, battery charging parameters (e.g. Maximum Charge Current, Target Battery Voltage, etc) are automatically configured by the Pylontech BMU, and communicated to the rest of the Victron components in the system via [[https://www.victronenergy.com/media/pg/Cerbo_GX_Device_Manual/en/dvcc---distributed-voltage-and-current-control.html|DVCC]]. 
 + 
 +It is possible to override some of these automatic settings to provide additional limitations (e.g. reduce the total charge current that would be provided but the MultiPlus). The following information is provided for that purpose, though is not required for the safe operation of the system.
  
 This section presumes familiarity with [[https://www.victronenergy.com/upload/documents/Manual-A-Guide-to-VEConfigure-EN.pdf|VEConfigure software.]]  This section presumes familiarity with [[https://www.victronenergy.com/upload/documents/Manual-A-Guide-to-VEConfigure-EN.pdf|VEConfigure software.]] 
  
-=== 4.1 General tab ===+Voltages shown are for the 48V model, and should be scaled for the 24V model. The 24V model is an 8-series configuration while the 48V model is a 15-series configuration. Voltages should therefore be scaled by 8/15. 
 + 
 +=== 5.1 General tab ===
  
   * Check the "Enable battery monitor" function   * Check the "Enable battery monitor" function
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   * The other parameters ("State of charge when bulk finished" and "Charge efficiency") can be left to their default setting: They are ignored for a Pylontech installation.   * The other parameters ("State of charge when bulk finished" and "Charge efficiency") can be left to their default setting: They are ignored for a Pylontech installation.
  
-=== 4.2 Charge Settings ===+=== 5.2 Charge Settings ===
  
 === Charger tab === === Charger tab ===
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 Note For off-grid use: ignore the 'bms assistant required' warning. Note For off-grid use: ignore the 'bms assistant required' warning.
  
-=== 4.3 Inverter Settings ===+=== 5.3 Inverter Settings ===
  
 In the Inverter tab of VEConfigure In the Inverter tab of VEConfigure
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 If operation is attempted outside the operating range, the battery will disconnect to protect itself. If operation is attempted outside the operating range, the battery will disconnect to protect itself.
  
-===== 5. GX Device Settings ===== 
  
-On the [[venus-os:start|GX device]], go to Settings, System setup: 
  
-^Venus Settings -> System Setup Parameter ^ Value ^  +===== 6. VE.Direct MPPT Settings =====
-|DVCC|ON| +
-|Shared Voltage Sense |OFF|  +
- +
-  * Select the //CAN-bus BMS (500 kbit/s)// CAN-profile in the CCGX. Menu path: //Settings -> Services -> CAN-profile//.  +
- +
-  * After properly wiring and setting up, the Pylontech will be visible as a battery in the device list. If you have multiple batteries a single entry will show up, which represents all batteries: +
-{{ :battery_compatibility:pylon-menu.png?nolink&400 |}} +
-  +
- +
-  * The parameters option within the battery page shows the actual battery charge and discharge limits +
-{{ :battery_compatibility:pylon-params.png?nolink&400 |}} +
- +
-This parameters page is also a good place to check that all batteries are connected and working properly. In normal working conditions, the current limit is 25A per cell. For example, 75A charge current limit ( 75 / 25 = 3 ) means there are 3 Pylontech battery modules connected.  +
- +
-===== 6. VE-Direct MPPT Settings =====+
  
 In normal operation the MPPT charge characteristics are governed by the [[venus-os:start|GX device]]  via DVCC, with instructions from the connected Pylontech battery.  In normal operation the MPPT charge characteristics are governed by the [[venus-os:start|GX device]]  via DVCC, with instructions from the connected Pylontech battery. 
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 This section presumes familiarity with [[victronconnect:start|VictronConnect]] This section presumes familiarity with [[victronconnect:start|VictronConnect]]
  
-The settings below are a precautionary measure. +The settings below can be set as a precautionary measure. 
  
 ^MPPT Parameter ^ Setting ^ ^MPPT Parameter ^ Setting ^
 |Battery voltage.     |48V| |Battery voltage.     |48V|
-|Absorption voltage   |53V|+|Absorption voltage   |52V|
  
 ===== 7. Example Wiring Diagram ===== ===== 7. Example Wiring Diagram =====
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 Pylontech's BMS will restrict the Charge Current Limit of the battery in cold weather. The precise temperatures and limits are not published by Pylontech, but anecdotally from reports on [[http://commmunity.victronenergy.com|Victron Community]] it would appear that batteries begin to be limited below 18 degree C, severely limited below 10 degrees C, and completely restricted from charging below 2 degrees C.  Pylontech's BMS will restrict the Charge Current Limit of the battery in cold weather. The precise temperatures and limits are not published by Pylontech, but anecdotally from reports on [[http://commmunity.victronenergy.com|Victron Community]] it would appear that batteries begin to be limited below 18 degree C, severely limited below 10 degrees C, and completely restricted from charging below 2 degrees C. 
  
-You can confirm if this is affecting your installation be entering the Pylontech Battery menu on your GX device, and then the Parameters Menu. This will report the Charge Current Limit (CCL) and Discharge Current Limit (DCL).+You can confirm if this is affecting your installation be entering the Pylontech Battery menu on your GX device, and then the Parameters Menu. This will report the Charge Current Limit (CCL) and Discharge Current Limit (DCL). This information is also logged in the advanced section of the VRM monitoring portal
  
-==== My system only charges the battery to 52V ====+==== My system only charges the battery to 52.4V ====
 When DVCC is enabled, the battery (via the CAN-bms) is responsible for the charge voltage. The Pylontech battery requests a charge voltage of 53.2V. We have however found that in practice this is too high. When DVCC is enabled, the battery (via the CAN-bms) is responsible for the charge voltage. The Pylontech battery requests a charge voltage of 53.2V. We have however found that in practice this is too high.
  
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 It should also be noted that a LiFePO4 cell stores very little additional energy above 3.45V. It should also be noted that a LiFePO4 cell stores very little additional energy above 3.45V.
  
-For this reason we opted to override the BMS and cap the voltage at 52V. This sacrifices almost none of the capacity and greatly improves the stability of the system.+For this reason we opted to override the BMS and cap the voltage at 52.4V. This sacrifices almost none of the capacity and greatly improves the stability of the system.
  
 ==== The battery won't charge to 100% ==== ==== The battery won't charge to 100% ====
-Also see the question above. The state of charge of the battery is estimated based on the overall voltage and on how well balanced the internal cells are. Because we cap the battery voltage at 52V, the state of charge will sometimes rise very slowly once it reaches the mid-90s. This is normal and usually resolves over time.+Also see the question above. The state of charge of the battery is estimated based on the overall voltage and on how well balanced the internal cells are. Because we cap the battery voltage at 52.4V, the state of charge will sometimes rise very slowly once it reaches the mid-90s. This is normal and usually resolves over time. 
 ===== 10. Further Information ===== ===== 10. Further Information =====
  
battery_compatibility/pylontech_phantom.txt · Last modified: 2020-09-19 11:53 by boekel